| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Evergreen |
Posted - 06/23/2003 : 8:12:36 PM
Today I went to Howard Dean's announcement of his candidacy for president of the US here in Burlington. Running on c-span if you want to see it).It was a very electrifying experience that didn't seem like your average campaign mumbo jumbo blabbing promises left and right just to win people over. I won't go on and on about how pro-Dean I am because I'll get rambling and this will be a book. I have been following his progress and principles long before today, but now I'm really excited about it all.
I urge everyone to explore all possible candidates for the next presidential election(if you plan on voting for someone besides bush). and check out some of the info on www.deanforamerica.com too!
I never focus on a particular politician because they are affiliated with a party (demo repub liberal etc.), more on the basis of following their principles and of course having principles I agree with. ( i picture alot of people on this board the same). Which is why I don't say "you have to vote for this guy he's going to be great". Different people have different principles and things they think are most important to have a decent country to live in. but I have to mention it to get the word out too because Dean is grassroots all the way. He has nothing for money compared to some of the people who will be running against him. But he does have principles, he's truthful and is genuinely concerned with regular people. I know that because he was my boss and I witnessed. See below.
As long as I was old enough to give a crap about presidents and the other various catagories of politicians, I have rarely seen one to get excited about or one who thinks the underserved, starving downtrodden families, elders, and people should be our first priority. Things he places first like balancing the federal budget and eliminating frivolous federal spending, enacting strick environmental laws that would improve our environment, alternative fuel resource use, the elimination of the native american reservation concept etc etc etc. The first one about underserved families hits the closest to home for me because I work with those families every day. I talk to people who moved from other states, both parents working and they couldn't make ends meet let alone have healthcare insurance. So many children never have any healthcare unless its bad enough to go to the ER. Howard Dean created a program called Dr. Dynasaur that ensures that every child in vermont and low income adults have full health care insurance including dental which is a necessity not a luxury(Deans words). AND vermont doesn't lose one bit of money by using this program to the fullest. In fact, the state budget WAS always in surplus with him as governor(14 yrs), even if the rest of the US was experiencing major recession. It took the new gov guy, who I don't like so far, less than one year to put this state so far in the red zone all they talk about is budget cuts for the state depts and programs. AND he wants to cut Dr. D the health insurance that never cost the state anything.
Interesting!
One more thing, because it's getting long, (sorry),(and it IS politics) I'm a state worker and when Dean was governor (ended last year because he didn't run due to the presidential campaign)of VT, he was my boss. Top of the ladder in my department, but always made a personable presence and got his hands dirty so to say. I've seen him and his policies work wonders for the state and the underserved people here. I know all the things I listed above are blabbed by politicians when election time rolls around to get votes, but I know first hand Dean would hold to his words because he did it here and I work right in the middle of the outcomes. But all of its on the website.
I'm not trying to sway anyone
and my opinions are not because he's from vermont
just asking that everyone explore all the options and really check it all out before we get to choose a leader next time.
and thanx for reading if you did. I had to express my excitement!
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| 31 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| victorwootenfan |
Posted - 07/07/2003 : 08:12:13 AM
Doesn't matter much to me about the whole "vote for 3d party is throwing your vote away." As we saw in 2000 some votes didn't count, and the majority of votes didn't pick the winner, so what does it even matter then if i choose to give my vote to nader. I think he'd be a great president, and if more people saw 3d party candidates as an actual president candidate, and not just a thrown away vote, then maybe one day someone like nader, or harry brown, or whoever, could get elected WITHOUT the backing of a huge and established party.
Just another ideal dream of mine tho... |
| Arthen |
Posted - 07/06/2003 : 01:16:06 AM
Don't forget! If the candidate gets a certain amount of the votes, they get federal funding. I think that's how it works. Eh, I'm not a government major so don't quote me on that. |
| PJK |
Posted - 07/05/2003 : 6:25:06 PM
Sometimes voting for a third party candidate is considered a throw away vote, but if you really believe in that person, then voting for them is the right thing to do. While it would be next to impossible for a third party candidate to win a presidential election because of the electorial college, it still can send a powerful message to Washington.
I do think this election is shaping up to be quite interesting.
Voting is more or less what you make it to be. The really sad thing is there are often names on the ballot for local offices that I don't know and yet I feel pressured to vote for one or the other. You really have to do your homework to be a smart voter and I am the first to admit there were times I probably shouldn't have voted because I wasn't familiar enough with the candidates. |
| dan p. |
Posted - 07/04/2003 : 01:02:45 AM
true, the lesser of two evil is still evil, but when faced with a lot of either or a little evil, which do you take? the lesser evil. unless you're evil. anyway, nader is very idealistic, but i will bet everything i own and secretly some of my brother's things that nader won't win. now, you can vote for him and say "i chose no evil." noble, except for the fact that by voting for nader and "choosing no evil", you've allowed another bad president into office. |
| victorwootenfan |
Posted - 07/03/2003 : 7:28:22 PM
quote:
Originally posted by dan p.
i think that virtually no one votes for third party people, so if your primary goal is get bush out, you should probably vote for whoever the democrat is, as opposed to voting for a 3rd which probably won't make it.
to quote nader about the 2000 election..."If you pick the lesser of two evils, you're still picking evil." Nahh, i'm not worried about booting bush out, because by then their could be a democratic leader just as bad, unless it's dean, cause i don't think you could go wrong there. |
| PJK |
Posted - 07/03/2003 : 6:07:18 PM
Regardless this seems to be a far more interesting election coming up than the previous one and I for one am glad!
I still would like them to pass a law that no Presidential returns can be put out by the news media until all the polling places in the US are closed! |
| dan p. |
Posted - 07/03/2003 : 5:22:41 PM
i think that virtually no one votes for third party people, so if your primary goal is get bush out, you should probably vote for whoever the democrat is, as opposed to voting for a 3rd which probably won't make it. |
| victorwootenfan |
Posted - 07/02/2003 : 10:27:07 AM
I think I'm gonna vote for nader...unless dean makes it through all the primaries and IS the democratic candidate. |
| Evergreen |
Posted - 07/02/2003 : 09:52:14 AM
Back to Dean....
www.moveon.org |
| Arthen |
Posted - 07/01/2003 : 6:42:33 PM
Heh. Is that something to be proud of? |
| victorwootenfan |
Posted - 07/01/2003 : 09:05:48 AM
you're doin' a helluva job HTG with those, if i was a betting man, i'd say you have flaming moe's on just about 75 percent off all threads on board after the flaming moe started... |
| {=HTG=} |
Posted - 07/01/2003 : 08:54:43 AM
Flaming Moe anyone? Haha! Two this morning!   |
| joojoo |
Posted - 07/01/2003 : 08:52:40 AM
All the dems are crazy about getting bush out of office. This is precisely the attitude that will prevent any dem from winning as things stand. follow this train:
Medicare is about to be taken care of. this year's 2nd fiscal quarter has been the best since '98, with all economists everywhere seeing nothing but green, upward pointing arrows in the future. We are beginning to find evidence of WMD's in iraq. the current roadmap to peace plan is seeing the best hopes for peace since the camp david accord, maybe better.
All this is under bush, all recent. add to that the fact that he was president during the single most defining moment in modern american history, 9/11. regardless of what you think, America responded to a strong image of Bush then. add to all that the tax cuts, and you have a George W. Bush who has victory after victory under his belt, with few, if any, noticeable weaknesses. Any dem candidate who defines him or herself as merely seeking to end bush's reign of terror (and ALL of them are, even old faithful dems like lieberman and Gephardt) are dead in the water. bottom line, point blank, period.
The Democratic Party's sole option, if they want to win, is to court and recruit Gen. Wesley Clark. I refer you to the Clark thread. If one were to divorce themselves from any type of loyalty for a moment and look at the facts, they'd see that Clark is simply the party's only hope of facing Bush. Clark dwarfs Bush in every way: he's smarter, more knowledgeable, more qualified, more experienced, etc. and, unlike every current Dem candidate, he doesn't have an angry, anti-bush image.
Personally, I'd like to see Clark win, if for nothing else than to see him run as incumbant in 08 so that Hillary Clinton can't run. If Hillary or Chelsea ever become president, I'll seriously consider doing away with my citizenship and moving to Holland. |
| victorwootenfan |
Posted - 07/01/2003 : 07:44:31 AM
I pulled out my newspaper today to read while eating breakfast, and came upon the letters to the editor. I immediately started laughing... A local "preacher" wrote in a letter saying "Good christians should not elect Dean." It was a short letter just saying that Dean stood for gay rights, and that was evil and immoral.
I just think to myself, "I pity this person, for they will never see out of their narrow prejudices into what the world is really like, and what people are actually like." I found it sad, but yet funny, that they guy was trying to make a serious point. |
| Fleabass76 |
Posted - 06/25/2003 : 6:13:32 PM
Well, yes, but they're not entirely responsible. Ultimately, it's a consumer's market, and consumers have to be happy, the boys at the banks decide how much money should be in circulation and stuff, which taxes affect too. Damn economics.. |
| dan p. |
Posted - 06/25/2003 : 5:04:55 PM
that's more like it. i was thinking more along the lines of alan greenspan and those in charge of the federal reserve, banks, that sort of thing. |
| Fleabass76 |
Posted - 06/25/2003 : 2:47:52 PM
quote:
Originally posted by dan p.
the president has little impact on the economy.
Yes, but a president with a friendly congress? |
| victorwootenfan |
Posted - 06/24/2003 : 6:25:27 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Ccr152
i think dean's campaign song should be "take the power back" by rage against the machine.
what a great song...god i miss rage against the machine...we needed them in this bush era! |
| dan p. |
Posted - 06/24/2003 : 4:43:33 PM
the president has little impact on the economy. |
| Arthen |
Posted - 06/24/2003 : 4:07:17 PM
Or "Put The Gas Mask On". |
| Ccr152 |
Posted - 06/24/2003 : 3:30:28 PM
i think dean's campaign song should be "take the power back" by rage against the machine. |
| victorwootenfan |
Posted - 06/24/2003 : 1:45:28 PM
as long as there can be a "likeable" person to oppose him, then there's a chance. A guy with a good personality(and money) is all it takes to be the president. |
| Fleabass76 |
Posted - 06/24/2003 : 1:27:20 PM
quote:
Originally posted by victorwootenfan
I haven't seen him speak yet, but i'll look this evening if he's on. I'd love to see someone bash bush in debating, then again it can't be too hard
Yeah, I'm pretty sure Forest Gump could rough him up. I think debates will be key for this election. Gore was "boring" and docile enough that dubya could sqeeze buy with his "funny numbers" tricks. Against a confident and decisive, quick on his feet opponent? No chance. I mean look at how the televised debates between Nixon and Kennedy affected that outcome. *crosses fingers* |
| victorwootenfan |
Posted - 06/24/2003 : 1:09:15 PM
I haven't seen him speak yet, but i'll look this evening if he's on. I'd love to see someone bash bush in debating, then again it can't be too hard |
| Fleabass76 |
Posted - 06/24/2003 : 12:51:51 PM
I just saw Dean speaking on CSpan. I think he might be the best candidate as far as speaking and enthusiasm goes. I definitely wouldn't mind watching him rip dubya a new one in debates. |
| victorwootenfan |
Posted - 06/24/2003 : 09:32:02 AM
Well the guy sounds good, and now that i'm of legal age to vote, he just may end up getting mine! Plus it's vermont, and that just flat out rocks! |
| Fleabass76 |
Posted - 06/24/2003 : 09:10:28 AM
Well, alot of it has to do with a president's attitude. Clinton had confidence in the economy, Bush doesn't and it scares people. There's much more beyond the surface, but that's what most people see. Bush has created tons of insecurity during his presidency, not to pin it all on him, but that's how he operates. The market hates insecurity. |
| Arthen |
Posted - 06/24/2003 : 03:22:49 AM
It's because the majority of the country generally only cares about the economy as a whole.
I don't like the idea that the economy's status is attributed to whoever is in office. When it was good during Bill Clinton's terms people thought it was his personal doing, and vice versa George Bush's situation. |
| Fleabass76 |
Posted - 06/24/2003 : 03:12:16 AM
That's not the only important issue though, and it's sad that the economy is what they're forced to focus on. This administration has created legistlation which will decimate the environment if it is not reversed SOON! Corporations have been givin free reign to polute because EPA standards have been lifted and the ability for the EPA to investigate and enforce violations has been lessened. National forests are being sold to the highest bidder among the loggers, and standards on drinking water have been lifted across the country. MMMM, dig that arsenic. |
| Arthen |
Posted - 06/24/2003 : 03:02:35 AM
Democrats have to hope that the economy will get worse. That will be the only way to the White House. |
| Fleabass76 |
Posted - 06/23/2003 : 8:40:40 PM
I have little hope for the democrats right now. There needs to be less fueding and more realistic debate. I'm tired of the "I'm going to reverse everything bush has done" stance. Yeah, it should be done, but what are you really going to do? |
